At Davos 2025, the 55th Annual Meeting of the World Economic Forum, Shelley Stewart III, senior partner at McKinsey, and Angela F. Williams, president and CEO of United Way Worldwide, sat down to discuss some of the key themes of the conference. The conversation explored investments in people, collaboration, AI and technology, and how United Way Worldwide is thinking about these themes in serving communities. Their discussion also highlights the importance of being in communities, hearing what the people need, and empowering them to pursue economic opportunities. This interview has been edited for clarity.
Shelley Stewart III: Hi. Thank you for joining us. My name is Shelley Stewart III. I’m a senior partner with McKinsey & Company, and I lead our global reputation function. I also lead all of our work on economic inclusion and mobility. I’m joined today by a wonderful guest, Angela F. Williams, the president and CEO of United Way Worldwide. Thank you for joining me. Talk a little bit about the organization and what you all do.
Angela F. Williams: Well, I love talking about United Way Worldwide. We are a 137-year-old organization for health and human services, operating in 36 countries. We focus on helping people in communities, whether it’s access to healthcare, youth opportunity, economic mobility, or community resilience.
Shelley Stewart III: Amazing. I love the mission and the global scale of what you do. It’s just so incredibly impressive, and I’m excited about this discussion. Before we get into the heart of it, I know folks want a little peek into Davos. How has your Davos been so far? What have the highlights been—other than it’s cold and we’re walking a lot?
Angela F. Williams: Well, I have to back up, because this is the third year that I’ve attended, and I’m still considering myself a newbie. But what I experienced, and I’m really surprised about, is there are so many incredible people from around the world in the nonprofit sector, the corporate sector, and government, and we can actually talk about issues affecting people in communities and put together partnerships and collaboration and share ideas. And so in the last couple of days, I have really had wonderful meetings with individuals. I see people on the street that I know from other places around the world. So it’s about connecting, and it’s about collaboration, and it’s about community.
Shelley Stewart III: That’s right. I think the thing for me is the accessibility, and it’s quite an efficient way to interact with a bunch of folks who have interesting ideas and thoughts.
Angela F. Williams: And so let’s not forget the fact that you and I met a year ago here.
Shelley Stewart III: We did. Top of the mountain.
Angela F. Williams: And you were the stranger saying, “Hey, can I have a meeting?” I was like, “Who’s this guy Shelley Stewart? Why do I want to meet with him?” And you seemed like an OK guy from your picture. And I said OK. And then we had a wonderful meeting, and here we are today.
Shelley Stewart III: We have been in touch since. Well, thank you for taking that meeting. So maybe jumping into it, one of the thematic priorities this year is this idea of investing in people. Speak a little bit about what that means for you personally but also what it means for the work of United Way Worldwide.
Angela F. Williams: So I’ll start with personally: I had the opportunity about two and a half hours ago to be one of the speakers at the interfaith worship opportunity. I quoted a lot from Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., and at the end of the day, no matter what the religion was that was presented, at the core of our humanity is this notion of love. And so when I can see you as a human being and it’s not about your politics, not about what country you’re from, or your language, or how you look different than me—if we start with basic humanity and love, we can go from there. And that then transitions into my work with United Way Worldwide. We are an organization whose mission it is to make sure that every person in every community can thrive.
Shelley Stewart III: It’s fitting that, thinking about Dr. King—given his birthday, which we celebrated on the 20th [of January, this year]—I’m always struck by the idea that love must have the last word. That’s always something that stays with me. So you mentioned the communities you’re in, and we at McKinsey did some work on the role of place as it contributes to someone’s economic mobility or potential opportunities. Talk a little bit about how you show up in places in your approach and the way places shape the outcomes of individuals.
Angela F. Williams: What we know is that there are some similarities from one community to another, from one country to another, but we also know that there are differences. For example, people would love to make sure that their children are educated, or second, people want to make sure that they can live healthy lives, which means getting access to food—and nutritious food at that. Or third, we know that people want to have the opportunity to make money so that they can survive. So let me give you an example. All of those things exist pretty much in every community that I just named. How it shows up with United Way, with our 1,100 local United Ways that are in communities, our staff are in the community. They have relationships, they live there, they know all of the leaders, they work with folks, and they understand and listen and hear about the issues facing that community.
I’ll give you an example in Ghana, the Kwamoso region. The village chief said he really wanted to help the women in the village who wanted to have economic mobility. The issue is that a lot of the men left the village. And so what we did with a partnership and funds from P&G Foundation was to take $14,000 and launch three businesses with the women: a bakery, a bead-manufacturing business, and soap manufacturing. Those women have turned their lives around, and especially the bakers; they have now trained hundreds of other women from other villages to launch bakeries. And I will just tell you as an aside, the women gave me a parting gift of some baked [bread], and it was nice and warm, fresh out of the oven. I ate the whole loaf before I got back into town because it was the best bread I’ve ever had.
Shelley Stewart III: Sounds like a franchising opportunity in DC or New York. I’m struck by this idea that when you do philanthropy or any work in communities, the folks in those communities understand better than you can ever understand what the needs are. But so often, you get a bit of a dynamic where people are coming in top-down and you don’t get that bottom-up knowledge share.
Angela F. Williams: And this is the role that I think, as you said, a lot of philanthropists and other do-gooders want to do: They come in with the savior complex. But why not go into a community, sit with the people, and ask them what’s important to them? We may say, “We want to give you food and help you grow crops.” And the community says, “Well, can we just have some fresh water?” That’s it, clean water. So we have to listen to people, and they actually can tell you the solutions to their problems, and they just need us to come alongside them. And that’s what I think is a privilege.
Shelley Stewart III: It’s amazing. One question. It almost feels like a false question because you and I are like-minded on this, but I’m going to ask anyway. There are some folks that see work, particularly when talking about focused investment in underserved communities, as a zero-sum game, as if you’re trying to create a new set of winners at the expense of others. Debunk that and talk a little bit about how you think about these kinds of investments in communities.
Angela F. Williams: So here’s how I think about it. For example, if you take a small amount of money to give to an entrepreneur in a low-income community that, say, wants to launch a food truck, or they want to start a nail salon or a barber shop, or they want to manufacture things, if you just give them a couple of hundred dollars or a couple thousand, that has almost an eight or ten times return because then they’re able to put money into the local community to buy more products for their family. It creates the opportunity for generational wealth. It allows them to move up the socioeconomic ladder and on and on and on. So if we were to do the work and be intentional about investing in people who have bright ideas, I’m telling you, it could really change the trajectory of this world because we are changing lives for generations.
Shelley Stewart III: I think that’s such a good point. One of the things I’ve been watching a bit is what the governor in Maryland is doing in this conversation around eradicating childhood poverty. And there was a frame like the one you discussed, which is we get more people and more economic activity happening by virtue of investing in this, but also it reduces downstream costs to the state later on, whether it be healthcare or otherwise. And I think we’ve got to have that holistic frame.
Angela F. Williams: Well, you just said healthcare. So think about this: If we were to focus on preventive health measures and reduce the amount of emergency room visits, that again creates a healthier economy and a healthier population and community. But we are not thinking like that. We talk about it, but I have yet to see solutions taken to scale for preventive healthcare, which means that people can still go to work and earn a living, especially day laborers or hourly wage earners. And that would keep the economic engine moving forward.
Shelley Stewart III: That’s right. I actually facilitated a session here in the Congress Center yesterday around investing in the health of your workforce. And the logic was along the same lines: If you make investments in your workforce, it will yield productivity benefits that will accrue to your company and to the economy as a whole. But there’s a bit of a time component that people have to get their head around.
So maybe shifting to another theme here: One of the other big topics is collaboration in the intelligent age and the idea that it’s going to take real collaboration, whether it be across nations, across sectors, or across institutions, to build stronger and more resilient economies, given all the change that we’re going through. What does collaboration in the intelligent age mean to you and United Way?
Angela F. Williams: For us, it’s all about collaboration. That’s the essence of our founding 137 years ago. By the way, we cover more than 95 percent of communities in the United States. And then in some of the other countries, we’re doing incredible work, and I would love to expand even more in these other countries. However, what I would say is that the essence of the ecosystem that we call the economy is the community, the individuals, and the households. And so then if that’s the hub of the community and we invest in households and individuals, then that means that businesses, when they want to open up in a community, are looking at factors such as: Is this a healthy community? What are the school systems like for our employees? What’s the longevity, and what is the economic opportunity to grow? But at the same time, where United Way comes in is as we’re partnering with companies, they are tapping us to provide support to their lower-wage earners. So we also talk about our ALICE project, which is asset limited, income constrained, employed: the working poor.
There are people that may be working one or two jobs, but they still need health and human support systems. And we have to think about how we provide those wraparound systems in places and in communities.
Shelley Stewart III: I think not enough people have an appreciation for how big the working poor is, and then how many of that population set work, one, two, even three jobs? I mean, it really is an important thing to discuss.
Angela F. Williams: Well, then that also raises the specter of: How do you go about providing living wages to people? That’s number one. And then the other topic it brings in: How do we invest in people who want to launch their own business, who have a vision and a dream for themselves? That’s something I think should be encouraged.
Shelley Stewart III: Absolutely. Economic engine. One of the things that I think is really unique about what you all do is you have a track record of collaborating with private enterprise, like you said, but also with government. And different parts of the government, whether it be state, local, federal, and then in different parts of the world. I happen to believe that the huge issues that we face as a society, whether it be climate or whether it be thinking about the implications of AI on what it means to work and inequality, it’s going to require significant collaboration across all sectors. Give us some lessons on how you work across the three: social, public, and private sectors.
Angela F. Williams: I’ll give you two really great recent examples. Just last week, we launched a website that Meta helped create, through open AI, a virtual chatbot that allows students in the United States who want to go to college to apply for student loans and to receive money to go to college. Those can be very tricky if you don’t know how to really put the information in for those forms. So we were pleased to be able to do that, to host that website. And it will make sure that high school students can get all of the funds that they need to go on to college. So that’s one example.
Another example in the energy space is that with a collaboration that we are in with four other nonprofits, we received $2 billion from the Environmental Protection Agency as part of the Greenhouse Gas Reduction Fund. The essence of this is to ensure that low-income households have the opportunity to reduce their utility costs. How do they do that? By having clean-energy appliances and heat-efficient, energy-efficient appliances. A lot of them don’t even know how to fill out those rebate forms or know how to go about selecting the right appliance they should have in their home.
And then what about someone to install? We have so many different incidents and case studies that we can show where you have someone like a United Way person who lives in the community, knows people from church or the grocery store, and can say, “Hey, can we tell you about this program? And we’ll help you get this.”
Shelley Stewart III: In that same vein, as I’ve gotten to know you and the organization better, you all are doing all sorts of impactful things. But one that’s really exciting that not a lot of people know that you all are involved in is 211. I would love to talk about 211 and also what you’re learning about community needs by offering that service.
Angela F. Williams: When I started as the CEO of United Way Worldwide three years ago, I didn’t even know about 211. And I will tell you it is the secret sauce of our organization when it comes to connectivity and communities. It is a national helpline both in Canada and the United States. When people call 211 and they have a need or a crisis, we have hotline operators who are able to connect them to resources in their community that are relevant. We take in over 40,000 calls a day. So what that means is it is the canary in the mine shaft. It will tell you some trends that are emerging at a very micro level that we should be aware of, that government should be aware of, that other parts of the ecosystem should know are happening and be able to get it in front of them as opposed to being reactionary.
And let me just say also, during times of disaster, whether it’s hurricanes or, most recently, the wildfires in Los Angeles, 211 has taken those calls. Thirty-four thousand people in Los Angeles are on the 211 waiting list because they don’t have housing. We’ve partnered with Airbnb to be able to get people into housing as soon as a disaster happens. We partner with Lyft when it comes to making sure that where people are food insecure or just unable to get groceries, we’re able to deliver to them. So whatever’s happening at the moment, 211 is there 24/7 to be able to be responsive.
Shelley Stewart III: One of the topics I know that you just mentioned in the context of LA is housing. We at McKinsey are very focused on this topic of affordable housing, and we have some new research coming on this topic. It really tries to examine the roots of why there is a housing shortage and what the implications of that are. And so I would just love to get your view on the housing crisis, affordable housing, and what you think needs to happen there to help unlock this. Because I do think this is an upstream thing that will unlock a bunch of things downstream, but I would love your view.
Angela F. Williams: So a number of our United Ways are actually focused on the lack of affordable housing, and what you’re seeing in communities now, at least in the United States—I’m being US-specific—is that people are being just completely outpriced; and where they could afford the home or it’s been a multigenerational house, they can’t keep it up. Or I think about Los Angeles: How many seniors lived in homes that were paid off and will be unable to rebuild? Or [what about] when a disaster happens and commercial entities come in, buy the property, and then people are displaced? So it is a very complex issue that, again, people haven’t really solved for. I think there are some innovative solutions around housing, and I would love to see those continue to grow. And I’d like to see local officials partner with nonprofits and partner with corporations to solve for it. One example: We were very successful in that kind of collaboration in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, where there was such intentionality to address homelessness, and they achieved their goal ahead of time.
Shelley Stewart III: I think for some people, it’s obvious, but some people don’t immediately connect this idea of affordable housing with the implications for employment, for education, and for access to basic social services, and so I think it’s absolutely something that we have to solve.
Angela F. Williams: Do you mind if I just say a word to that? So the United Way also partners with the Siemer Institute, and Barb and Al Siemer recognized that unless you dealt with homelessness and lack of food—but primarily homelessness and all of the other social wrappings—a kid will not go to school, number one. And if they do go to school, they’re not going to learn because there are so many other needs. And so when we think about how we work together within communities, meet the needs, and find shelter for the family, then that allows the child to be able to go to school, which then gives them the opportunity to grow up to be a contributing citizen later on.
Shelley Stewart III: I don’t want to get too philosophical, but I think given the prosperity that at least the US has collectively, we should be able to ensure that folks all have places to live.
Angela F. Williams: I think in a lot of countries that’s the case.
Shelley Stewart III: It’s a good segue when you say a lot of countries. As I’ve talked to folks and been involved in conversations here this week, one of the big things looming over the conversations is this uncertainty around the geopolitical landscape, and pieces on the board are moving around. I mean, you’ve obviously got full-fledged conflicts in certain parts of the world. I heard the head of the Red Cross yesterday say something like they have more than 100 designated live conflicts in the world, which surprised me, and we need to reverse that trend. And she made a compelling case. As a leader of a global organization, how are you thinking about the geopolitics of the moment? And how does it impact your organization or the mission?
Angela F. Williams: So for me, it’s thinking about how we can, consistent with our mission, remain relevant and in community in a way that we’re continuing to serve despite what’s happening all around. I will give you an example. The first day of the Ukrainian War, our Hungary United Way jumped into their United Way vans and crossed the border to start helping refugees coming [across]. And it was incredible. In fact, our CEO at that time happened to have her diabetes medication, her insulin, in her purse, and she ran into a woman who was in need of insulin and was able to share.
I mean, it’s like real time, one person touching another. The other thing that my colleagues did in Romania, Germany, and Poland was, as the refugees were coming across, they would help take primarily the women aside to let them cry, to exhale. And then they had pop-up playgrounds for the children so that they could play and just start reorienting them to a new life. A really wonderful example is the United Way in the Netherlands. They realized that there were mental health issues not only with the adults but also with the children as a consequence of being a refugee as part of a war. So they took those Ukrainian psychiatrists, counselors, and psychologists who weren’t able to practice in the Netherlands, but they became employees of United Way and then were able to do the counseling in the language within the cultural context of fellow refugees to help them out. So that’s how United Way shows up in places whenever there’s a conflict.
Shelley Stewart III: The thing that’s most inspiring about that is the agility of the organization to pivot and to address issues in real time. And that example really resonated with me. It wouldn’t be Davos in post-2022 if we didn’t mention technology and AI. We made it a long time without mentioning it. How is it influencing the work that you do or how do you foresee it influencing it in the future, hopefully as something that will expand the impact of your mandate? But I would love to just hear how you’re thinking about technology in your organization.
Angela F. Williams: I want to embrace it. And I think that it’s important that our sector has the ability to embrace AI and use it in the work that we do on a daily basis, just like companies do and governments do. The issue is, we don’t necessarily have the funding or the expertise to do what needs to be done. So for me, it’s about partnering in collaboration with those that can work with us. And my aha moment yesterday morning at an AI session was: I said to my husband, if United Way Worldwide doesn’t get AI and technology and embrace it in a way that’s meaningful, it will be a loss for this sector.
Because we’re such a large entity and we partner with more than 20,000 other nonprofits, I feel like it’s our mandate as an organization to understand AI and be able to utilize it and deploy it in the work that we do so that we can ensure that systemic inequalities don’t remain, that we ensure that those who don’t have the wherewithal, no matter where they are, are not left behind and the gap widens. I don’t want that to happen. So we have to figure this out.
Shelley Stewart III: Well said. What are you most optimistic about for the year ahead? It could be personal, it could be about the organization, or it could be about society.
Angela F. Williams: One, I am optimistic about human resilience. I feel that the best comes out of us the more we feel squeezed and compressed because there are not a lot of options. And then you have to focus on: OK, what is the solution? Who else can I talk to and work with to make sure that we survive and thrive? So I am intent on making sure that not only United Way Worldwide, as an incredible organization, but also I, personally, really do what it takes to be able to be good neighbors. And most important, to say to someone, I see you, I love you. We’re in it together.
Shelley Stewart III: I love that. And actually, I’m going to end this where we started with this notion of the common things that are just part of being human. And I heard a great quote, and it gets us out of our echo chambers. It was that families teach us love, the tribes teach us loyalty, but the village teaches us tolerance. This is what that tolerance is all about: We have a set of common things, and we should focus more on those things, which I think is along the lines of what you’re saying.
